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Post by Al-pocalypse on Jan 18, 2016 10:07:38 GMT
Am I looking at upgrading my Powerplant and Distributor to A grade. These should be able to power 4x size 1 Beam Lasers almost continuously.
Am I better going with 4 fixed, 4 gimbled or a mix of 2 and 2?
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Post by Souvarine on Jan 18, 2016 10:11:30 GMT
I have four gimballed C1 beam lasers on mine and A grade power kit - you get about seven seconds continuous fire with four pips in weapons.
I would advise four gimballed - the Asp doesn't have the pitch speed to keep fixed weapons trained on targets for long enough, and targeting individual modules would be very hard.
I also personally wouldn't mix gimbals with fixed for the same weapon type - unnecessarily confusing!
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Post by Al-pocalypse on Jan 18, 2016 10:15:59 GMT
Cheers! I shall have a go tonight.
I next need to decide whether to keep my size 2 multicannons or to look at a different form of projectile weapon.
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Post by Souvarine on Jan 18, 2016 10:26:50 GMT
C2 Multicannons are amongst the most effective weapons for their class in the game - they tear through small and medium ships, and make a pleasing 'ratatat' sound on hulls!
Vex tells me C2 fragment cannons are also very effective - especially at shorter range. They fire explosive buckshot.
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Post by Tanith Low on Jan 18, 2016 11:47:55 GMT
I love the fragments but they need to be used on a faster ship then the Asp since you need to be at point blank before you pull the trigger for the best effect. Canons could work though, much better against large targets and better hull penetration. As for the beams I've gone with 2 C1 Pulse and 2 C1 Beam, all gimbals. I like the balance of damage and ability to fire continuously. Al do you know about this coriolis.io/Put your build together in it and post it up, so we can tell you you're wrong! my build currently looks like this coriolis.io/outfit/asp/05A5A5A4D4A5A5C2g2g0p0p18180l0404023d4a020202v62f.Iw18WQ==.IwBhrSqi1I==?bn=Eye%20of%20Horus
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Post by Ronnie Kane on Jan 18, 2016 12:36:01 GMT
4 gimballed beams work very well for me on my asp. 2 medium multi-cannon to support them.
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Post by Souvarine on Jan 18, 2016 13:48:07 GMT
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Post by Al-pocalypse on Jan 26, 2016 8:48:32 GMT
So I think I've found my Asp weapon loadout:
4x Size 1 beam lasers 2x Size 2 rail guns
Heat management is a slight issue against very heavily armored targets who need a lot of rail fire. However, these targets can be evaded whilst my ship cools down a little.
I currently have the beam lasers gimbled. However, I am considering trying fixed for the increased damage and it would mean a common sighting system for them and my rails. Though I'll have to weight this off against the sluggish turning of the ASP against fast targets.
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Post by Souvarine on Jan 26, 2016 10:13:11 GMT
I'd be worried about three things when it comes to fixed vs gimballed beams on the Asp:
1. Convergence. They are spread several metres apart, in a line - difficult to bring all four to bear against small ships. Even medium-sized ones at a distance. 2. Module-sniping. Impossible to bring all to bear on a specific module, especially considering... 3. The Asp's manouvrebility. I don't think it has the pitch rate to keep a lock on most targets without the help of gimbals.
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Post by Al-pocalypse on Jan 26, 2016 10:46:56 GMT
I'd be worried about three things when it comes to fixed vs gimballed beams on the Asp: 1. Convergence. They are spread several metres apart, in a line - difficult to bring all four to bear against small ships. Even medium-sized ones at a distance. 2. Module-sniping. Impossible to bring all to bear on a specific module, especially considering... 3. The Asp's manouvrebility. I don't think it has the pitch rate to keep a lock on most targets without the help of gimbals. I'd thought of the 3rd, but not the first two. Definitely good points and worth considering! I still think I will have a go this evening, but I will keep an eye out for those issues and if they do crop up then I'll revert back to gimbals.
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Post by Tanith Low on Jan 27, 2016 9:36:38 GMT
It's interesting to note that most hardcore PvPers consider fixed to be the way to go for PvP. even on things like the Conda and Python.
I wouldn't myself but it is interesting.
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Post by Souvarine on Jan 27, 2016 9:40:13 GMT
There could be an element of etiquette to that. As in: they consider gimbals to be an unfair advantage. Perhaps.
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Post by Al-pocalypse on Jan 27, 2016 10:23:33 GMT
Coming from a PvP background in similar games and my (limited) experience so far in Elite Dangerous. I can definitely see the benefit of going with the fixed variant of your weapon of choice, as these give the best DPS and DPE. This is because, with experienced PVPers, they will do their best not to be in your line of sight at all, whether gimbals or fixed and if they're in sight for gimbals, a decent pilot should be able to train fixed points on them very fast. Therefore you want whatever is going to do the most damage in the short time you have the opponent on your screen.
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Post by Tanith Low on Jan 27, 2016 11:47:15 GMT
Having read the discussion on this I think Al's right. It's generally considered that if you're good enough then fixed are the way to go. But you need to be really really good for a small improvement in damage output.
It's also ship specific, for example the clipper you almost have to use gimbals for some load outs because of the weapon placement.
As far as etiquette goes I quote you Terry Pratchett
The last words of a surprisingly large number of people were “Stuff the bloody Marquis of Fantailler-"
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Post by Al-pocalypse on Jan 27, 2016 11:57:17 GMT
As far as etiquette goes I quote you Terry Pratchett The last words of a surprisingly large number of people were “Stuff the bloody Marquis of Fantailler-" Aye, unless you're sparing with friends; PvP isn't about who is right, only who is left.
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Post by Tanith Low on Jan 27, 2016 13:43:28 GMT
OK, so I've just spent an hour or so in the Ipilaqa CZ with a fixed beam on the vulture. Now bear in mind the vulture is probably one of the best ships to put a fixed weapon on as it's pretty damn nippy. Also bear in mind that this is just my experience. Your mileage may vary.
My experience was...mixed. Against larger ships it is devastating. Certainly worth it and the slight gimbal effect that they have (a sort of auto convergence) means that targeting sub systems is actually not a problem. Asp and larger is really where they come into their own.
Against medium sized ships it's OK, no better or worse than a gimbal. Cobras and other vultures are large enough that they can be hit straight forwardly and the extra damage cancels the time I spend missing.
Small ships however are their Achilles heel. Vipers, couriers and eagles are a small enough target that move fast and keeping the weapon trained on them becomes a huge frustration. The TTK is much larger than it is with gimbals and so if you're attacked by a group it can get very hairy very fast. They just don't have the damage output to compensate for the amount of time I miss.
This may be why they are the preferred weapon for PvP. Most of the time you will be facing larger opponents and so the benefits really come into play. I suspect that even a fully tricked out battle python, flown by an experienced PvPer will jump is he gets pulled over by 3 or 4 middling Cmdr eagles.
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Post by Souvarine on Jan 27, 2016 13:49:24 GMT
TTK?
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Post by Al-pocalypse on Jan 27, 2016 14:01:34 GMT
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